My Letters To & From Author To Robert Pirsig Concerning His Book Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance (ZMM). Years 1994 thru 2005.

Note: Mr. Pirsig nearly always included his own address along with the current date at the top of his letters to me. Mindful of his concern for privacy, I have removed these (his) addresses in the letters copied to this webpage. (As will be noted, a few of my letters to Pirsig are unfortunately missing.)

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A second document, also on this website, has letters to/from Pirsig for 2006 thru 2007. See link in menu upper left.

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Starting in 2003, My Physics "A" Students Were Required to Read ZMM. Late In June 1994 I Asked Mr. Pirsig For Information Re Other Universities That May Have Such Requirements.

There were many important and valid reasons for this Physics requirement which may be found at the first link below. But I worried that other teachers or administrators might become critical, so I sought additional support for this teaching practice, especially since this ZMM requirement was quite unusual. I asked Mr. Pirsig if he knew of other schools that also required ZMM in their classes. As an afterthought I also asked about total ZMM circulation and if there was a map of the ZMM Route. (Unfortunately, this letter is missing.) Here are two WebPages related to the above topics. Mr. Pirsig's reply is next below.
Why I required my physics students to read ZMM in Sophomore Physics.
How ZMM is used in Universities discovered by Google Search.

Mr. Pirsig's Reply To My Question Re Requirement That My University Physics Students Read ZMM. Dated July 9, 1994.

Dear Dr. Gurr,

It's good to see that you are taking up Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance with your students. Many just read it and say, "Isn't that interesting," and then go on with other things. To keep you interested, I'm enclosing two other books that you may not have read yet. Your question "a)" is answered in Section 2 of Guidebook to Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance.

In answer to question "b)" I would estimate that somewhere between 10 and 60 per cent of colleges and high schools use ZMM in one or more courses. Usually these are literature or philosophy courses, sometimes psychology and sociology— rarely science. U.S. sales have been running at about 100,000 per year for the last 20 years, a really unusual figure. It has been stated in the London Daily Telegraph and by the BBC that ZMM is the "most widely read philosophy book — ever." I give credit to the academic system for this, but I don't have any accurate information on who is using it or where it is being used.

I didn't pay for the two enclosed books, so you shouldn't either. But please pay attention to the assertion by the Metaphysics of Quality in Lila that quality is an empirical phenomenon. It is traditional for scientific thinkers to deny this but I don't think it is rational for scientific thinkers to deny this. This is the central assertion of ZMM, but the Metaphysics of Quality shows how, once this assertion is accepted, it is possible to construct an overall view of things that integrates such things as physics and morals without doing damage to either.

Best regards,

Signed by hand

Robert M Pirsig

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I Sent Mr. Pirsig Excerpts From Writings of Mr. Owen Barfield Which Supported ZMM Discussions of Subject-Object Split Way-Back In History. Also, I Asked Mr. Pirsig How His Quality Could Be an Empirical Phenomenon. Dated September 13, 1994

I had found a number of interesting points of agreement between Mr. Barfield and ZMM, and wanted to see if Mr. Pirsig was aware of this. Also, I asked Mr. Pirsig how his quality could be an empirical phenomenon. (Unfortunately this letter is also missing.)

Dear Prof. Gurr,

The following quotation found at the bottom of page 75 of the paperback edition of Lila is, I think, what you are looking for: the clear, overt statement that quality is an empirical phenomenon.

The Metaphysics of Quality restates the empirical basis of logical positivism with more precision, more inclusiveness, more explanatory power than it has previously had. It says that values are not outside of the experience that logical positivism limits itself to. They are the essence of this experience. Values are more empirical, in fact, than subjects or objects.

Any person of any philosophic persuasion who sits on a hot stove will verify without any intellectual argument whatsoever that he is in an ably low-quality situation: that the value of his predicament is negative. This low quality is not just a vague, woolly-headed, crypto-religious, metaphysical abstraction. It is an experience. It is not a judgment about an experience. It is not a description o experience. The value itself is an experience. As such it is completely predictable. I is verifiable by anyone who cares to do so. It is reproducible. Of all experience it is the least ambiguous, least mistakable there is. Later the person may generate some oaths to describe this low value, but the value will always come first, the oaths second. Without the primary low valuation, the secondary oaths will not follow.

The reason for hammering on this so hard is that we have a culturally inherited blind spot here. Our culture teaches us to think it is the hot stove that directly causes the oaths. It teaches that the low values are a property of the person uttering the oaths.

Not so. The value is between the stove and the oaths. Between the subject and the object lies the value. This value is more immediate, more directly sensed than any "self" or any "object" to which it might be later assigned. It is more real than the stove. Whether the stove is the cause of the low quality or whether possibly something else is the cause is not yet absolutely certain. But that the quality is low is absolutely certain. It is the primary empirical reality from which such things as stoves and heat and oaths and self are later intellectually constructed.

Thank you for the chapter from Barfield. It's always a pleasure to read someone who says exactly what you already think. It was not made clear enough in Lila, but the Metaphysics of Quality resolves the subject-object problem by containing it at a high level so that there really is no contradiction between the two systems of metaphysics. The MOQ says that the two lower levels of static patterns of quality—inorganic and biological—are exactly synonymous with what is called "objective." The two upper levels—social and intellectual—are exactly synonymous with what is called "subjective." The terms "objective" and "subjective" are no longer needed in any way. They should be avoided as imprecise and confusing. If you get in the habit of stopping every time you see the word "subjective" or "objective" and substitute the appropriate static value level, you will find a lot of fallacious thinking suddenly becomes very apparent, particularly in the social sciences.

I notice that Barfield uses the term "meaning" which is also avoided in the MOQ. "Meaning" confuses two distinct entities which the MOQ sharply distinguishes as, "value" and "definition." When a scientist asks "What is the meaning of this phenomenon?" he may be confusing two entirely separate questions: (1) "What is the value of this phenomenon?" and (2) How does this phenomenon integrate intellectually with what we already know?

By using this equivocal term some scientists find they can make value judgments without' admitting they are doing so. They cannot say, "This is important because I like it," so they say, "This is meaningful!" If someone challenges them by asking, "Why is it meaningful?" they can evade question (1) "What is the value?" by answering question (2) with a lengthy explanation of how the phenomenon in question integrates with our existing knowledge. I have seen this happen again and again and imagine you have too.

When Barfield talks about meaning he is talking about meaning, and putting it exactly where the MOQ puts quality, as a larger container that contains both subjective entities and objects. Quality and meaning, are the same thing. Intellectual static patterns of quality and meaning, are also the same thing.

The MOQ does not agree with Steiner (on p.208 of Poetic Diction) when he says "thinking transcends the distinction of subject and object." According to the MOQ thinking is subjective. But the MOQ does agree with Steiner when he says consciousness transcends the distinction between subject and object because the MOQ says that' not all consciousness is thinking. Artistic consciousness precedes thinking and is separate from it both in the judgment of Freshman composition and in jumping up from a hot stove, and also, I think, in the making of scientific discoveries.

Inspiration" is a pretty good equivalent for Dynamic Quality but "inspiration" has historical connotations of some mysterious perfume that enters the body from some place afar. It is supposed to be some kind of object that enters the subject. That is not what Dynamic Quality is. Dynamic Quality is here all the time, engulfing both subject and object, and people become more or less sensitive to it as they become detached from existing static patterns. When Louis Agassiz had his students studying a fish for days I think he was trying to free them from their narrow-minded static patterns about the fish so that the Dynamic Quality of their experience would shine through and produce new static patterns, i.e. "discoveries." Zen meditation teachers do the same thing without limiting the discovery to a particular field.

Anyway, it is certainly good to see that you are continuing your interest in the Metaphysics of Quality and also getting your students' minds into it. Right now I'm immersed in the static patterns of sailboat restoration, learning to weld aluminum and stainless steel by the metal-inert-gas process. Your letter about the MOQ has provided a refreshing relief from it.

Best regards,

Signed by hand

Robert M Pirsig

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My Letter to Mr. Pirsig Reporting My Use of ZMM In My Physics Classes and Suggesting He Re-travel the ZMM Route & Photograph ZMM Sights That Still Remained. Dated 6 June 2001.

Dear Mr. Pirsig

I am the person who wrote you about seven years ago about the use of your book Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance in my physics class. (Please see attached Xerox.) In my classes, your book has helped over 140 students improve their understanding of Physics and also gain a better understanding of their overall education. I have used ZMM as a supplementary reading to a physics class for altogether six school years. In the process I have become convinced of the long term value of your book.

Based on the lasting value or your book, I believe efforts should be conducted to document as much as possible the actual physical trail of the original trip upon which ZMM is based. For example, some of the buildings that still exist might be designated as ”Historical ZMM Monuments" if the locations of these buildings could be documented.

While you are in good health (which I trust is the case) you (and if possible John and Sylvia), could retrace your trip that is so well described in ZMM. Various methods could be used to document what you find. These days with the ready availability of Word Processors, Video Recording Cameras, and Ground Position Systems (GPS) it should be relatively easy and modest cost to make a permanent record in words, photographs, and precise physical geographic location, the prominent sites and the actual roads traversed. This information would be of lasting value to future generations.

I understand that the trip in ZMM, for literary reasons, may be quite different from the actual trip. But this probably would not be an issue when it comes to an effort of historical preservation. This effort would be similar to the preservation efforts of Local Historical Societies who make records and museums of our past.

If I could be of any assistance to such a venture please let me know. You may find out more about me at my WWW address below. My email address is also below.

Sincerely

Henry Gurr
Professor of Physics
University of South Carolina Aiken
471 University Parkway
Aiken SC 29801
HenryG@Aiken.SC.edu
http://www.ZMMquality.org [Now obsolete.]----

Mr. Pirsig's Reply To My Proposal That He Re-Travel and Photograph the ZMM Route. Dated June 24, 2001.

Dear Prof. Gurr,

I'm glad to read that ZMM has been so useful to your physics classes. It's holding up in the marketplace too with steady sales. The term, "cult book" is now in almost complete remission in the ads and reviews and here and there the term, "classic" has appeared.
At age 72, the Great American West no longer beckons to me for a summer vacation but on page 19 of "Guidebook to Zen And the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance," by DiSanto and Steele there is a map of the trip described in ZMM. A have heard from Bozeman that there has been a steady trickle of what they call "Pirsig Pilgrims" who come through every summer following that route. However, of greater value to you may be the internet site www.moq.org. which started up in 1998 and has generated many hundreds of pages of archives about the Metaphysics of Quality contained in ZMM and Lila. Some of the members of the group feel the metaphysics is more compatible with modern physics than any other philosophical system. Others disagree. It sounds like your contributions would be welcome there.

Best regards,

Signed by hand

Robert M Pirsig

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My Letter to Mr. Pirsig Reporting My Use of ZMM In My Physics Classes and Asking Him For Feedback Re My Proposal That I Travel the ZMM Route & Photograph ZMM "Sights & Scenes." Dated 23 March 2002.

Dear Mr. Pirsig,

Thank you for your letter of June 24, 2001. I have studied www.moq.org web site as you suggested, but do not have a solid enough foundation to yet make contributions. My next major project is to study the relationship of your ZMM and LILA to the writings of Scientist-Philosopher, Michael Polanyi, and Philologist-Linguist Owen Barfield. I hope that this will prepare me to have something to say to the subscribers of moq.com.

The purpose of this letter is to ask your advice and assuming my ideas are consistent with your own priorities, ask for your help.

As you probably may have already guesses I have (for a long time) wanted to, travel the "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance Route". Your June 24 letter said, "I have heard from Bozeman that there has been a steady trickle of what they call 'Pirsig Pilgrims' who come through every summer following that route". Well …. this summer I probably will head for Minneapolis, and try my hand at becoming a Pirsig Pilgrim!

My current plans are to leave South Carolina mid to late May, see relatives in Ohio and Indiana, possibly conduct research in Chicago area, see friends in Wisconsin, and then proceed to Minneapolis to start the official ZMM trip. The “trail” will take me to San Francisco where I will see my son in nearby Palo Alto.

I have researched maps and travel information such as is given in DiSanto and Steele's "Guidebook to ZMM" as well as my Rand-McNally highway map. In the process of studying my Minnesota map, I deduced, from the clues given in ZMM, that the ZMM trail out of Minneapolis was most probably Route 55, and the first night motel was likely on Main Street, Oakes ND. There are currently only two motels listed in Oakes, both on opposite ends of Main Street. (Again, thank you for sending me a copy of DiSanto and Steele's very useful book!)

As I travel, I plan to actively search for the historical sites and scenes described in ZMM. I should be able to identify actual (or probable) motels, hotels, restaurants etc. Specific ZMM scenes inside Montana Hall on the Montana State Bozeman Campus are probably also identifiable. The "Landscape Scenes" of ZMM will, of course, have less specific physical locations. But to experience these "Landscape Scenes", specific road segments and safe stopping points for a good rest while viewing the scenery as described in ZMM, could be identified. I probably will also discover places wherein future ZMM Pilgrims could effectively experience some of the “Quality Landscape Scenes” used to support your ZMM Chautauquas in ZMM. Also I may discover locations of restful places where the Traveler may rest and reflect on their trip and their life. These places for “Journaling” and "Special Readings" would be away from the noise and hustle of the everyday. (Suggestion of USCA English Professor, Stanley Rich.)

There is no doubt that I will be able to collect a considerable amount of potentially useful Information. For example: photographs, maps, and directions to any ZMM sites or scenes as may still exist. I anticipate making this information available to serious researchers, at minimal to zero cost, certainly no profit. Some of this information might become part of: 1) A second edition of DiSanto and Steele's ZMM Guidebook, 2) Or a “Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance Pilgrims Resource Book”. I have written to Ron DiSanto and Thomas J. Steele to see if they have any desire to make use of the information I am about to collect.

Your advice is sought: Some of the information I collect could be eventually placed on an interned web page and thereby available to the public. In your opinion, would such a web site support, and expand the public's appreciation of your two books and other literary efforts? Or would you worry that this web site would direct the public's attention away from a proper understanding of your works, possibly fostering, God forbid, just another tacky tourist attraction? I truly desire to help people to expand, to respond, and indeed to directly experience the central messages you have worked so hard to create. Please let me know what you think.

Preamble: If I am too bold in my following requests for your help, please forgive me. Some of which I propose may involve your extra expense to hire research or clerical assistance. In that event, I will gladly reimburse you. And after reviewing my appeals for help, you desire not to be involved, I will, of course, accept your decision as final. Indeed how could I do other than understand and respect your right to choose your own agenda.

Your assistance is sought: I am writing to you to see if you would be willing to supply information, even rough incomplete clues, that may speed up the search process for actual physical ZMM historical sites. Examples: 1) You could look into any your old records that may exist to see if descriptive information or location clues may be found concerning the restaurants, motels, action scenes etc. of ZMM. 2) From memories of your return to Bozeman, described in ZMM, possibly draw maps of your walks about town, your camping trail in Cottonwood Canyon. 3) From memory, make a rough sketch of the floor plan of Montana Hall showing, a) where your old office was, b) The location of the Feininger reprint "Church of the Minorities", c) the classrooms you taught in, and d) where Sarah's office was. The more clues you could provide, any where along the route, the better. I believe the actual ZMM route is already fairly well defined, but there are many, many other examples where advanced information from you would be a great assistance. Of course your records may be sketchy and your memories might be inaccurate, but what ever you can offer, will be better than nothing.

You may know of other persons who have traveled the ZMM route or have other information. Would you be willing to assist me in contacting them? You might have reservations about giving out their names, but you might be willing to ask these persons to contact me.

Many changes, of course, no doubt have happened since ZMM was written. But that's history we have to accept and record. I must always remember that the trip described in ZMM, for literary reasons, may be quite different from the actual trip. But this probably would not be an issue when it comes to an effort of documentation of whatever sites or scenes may be found.

Please let me know what you think of the above ideas. If I may be of assistance to you in any way, please do not hesitate to ask.

Sincerely

Henry Gurr, Professor of Physics Emeritus
University of South Carolina Aiken
471 University Parkway
Aiken SC 29801

[ADDED ENCLOSURE: An approximately 4 page "Henry Gurr Progress Report" was included with the above letter. It documented my efforts in searching (library and internet) for information concerning who had already traveled the ZMM Route and what was known of the sights there along. Most of the content if this report is now posted various places on my website.]
http://www.usca.edu/math/~mathdept/hsg/ZMMFindSiteInfo.html
http://venturearete.org/ResearchProjects/ProfessorGurr/Documents/ZMMTravelGuide

Mr. Pirsig's Reply To My Idea To Research & Photograph the ZMM Route. Dated March 28, 2002.

Dear Prof Gurr

The experiences in ZMM are getting pretty dim in memory. The students I had in those classes in Bozeman are now 62 years old! This may help explain the limited recall you are encountering at Montana State University and elsewhere. However I am happy to report that, according to Amazon.com and Barnes & Noble, ZMM is outselling Anna Karenina, the book preferred by the U of Chicago head of the Ideas and Methods committee.

I see no harm and some benefit in the journey you're planning. Others have done it, the most thorough of whom is Sven Lindqvist, a Swedish journalist and author. I have filed it on the enclosed CD under the title of "Kultur & Nojen." The other reviews contain more opinion than information but since they were already on the CD I have included them too for anything that might be useful to you.

The English department was moved out of Montana Hall not long after I left and the entire floor was remodeled, beyond recognition, for administrative use. I looked in there one year and found the President of the University sitting where my students used to be. The original of the "Church of the Minorites" may still be in the Walker Art Center in Minneapolis, and is of course much better than my cheap reprint. Cobb Hall sounds like the place where the enormous round table was. The hospital might not have been right across the street.

To get a feeling of the mountains around Bozeman you might explore Hyalite Canyon, which is one canyon east of Cottonwood Canyon where the De Weeses’ lived. If you drive to the end and then follow the trail up to Hyalite Lake using a Geodetic survey map you will see more trails branching from there that are fabulous climbs. Better be in shape though.

Others who have taken your intended trip and written to me about it couldn't find the site of the climax with Chris. This was partly because the actual site was a little hairpin turn in a minor road and not by any cliff, and partly because I accidentally gave incorrect directions for it. Today a housing development surrounds it, but here, for the record, are maps of where I think it is.

Best regards,

Signed by hand

Robert M Pirsig

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My Letter to Mr. Pirsig Thanking Him For a CD Having The Reports of Sven Lindqvist's Traveled The ZMM Route. Dated 8 April 2002.

Dear Mr. Pirsig,

Thank you for your letter of March 28, 2002. I appreciate your willingness to supply advice and help me with my project. It was good to have information on hiking trails near Bozeman and the maps of where the climax scene took place.

Also thank you for the Computer CD that you included. It is indeed a remarkable literary resource!! I am most appreciative for your willingness to share that "library" with me! The CD "opened" immediately on my computer, and I believe I was able to fully access all the files on this disk. I made archival copies immediately.

Sven Lindqvist's articles on the CD were wonderful. He did indeed discover and documented a great amount of ZMM site information. It was very much what I was looking for and vastly exceeds my efforts so far. His information will greatly enhance my search, and will provide an advanced platform from which to discover additional historical locations.

Your help in showing me Mr. Lindqvist's articles is indeed "spring shower" of blessing! There is no way, on my own, I would have discovered what he had written! Big thanks right here!!!

Mr. Lindqvist most probably has even more information than he was able to place in his articles. I hope it will meet with your approval for me to contact him directly and find out what he is willing to share.

As I get more time, I will scan through the text of all the articles on the CD for any additional ZMM site information. I enjoyed reading the London Observer review by Philip Toynbee and several others.

I have included a copy of my Vita for your interest. Please note the "Two Wheeled Car" entry in PERSONAL.

Sincerely

Henry Gurr, Professor of Physics Emeritus
University of South Carolina Aiken
471 University Parkway
Aiken SC 29801

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My Letter to Mr. Pirsig Reporting My Successful ZMM Route Research Trip Plus Other Follow-up Questions. Dated 30 August 2002.

Dear Mr. Pirsig,

I trust this letter finds you well and you are making progress with your Heli-Arc Welding.

You may be interested to hear that my trip to research the present status of the "sights and scenes" depicted in your book "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" has been successfully completed. It was a fantastic journey, but simultaneously strenuous and exhausting even in the comfort of a 1994 Plymouth Acclaim (i.e. a compact car). I am safely home with some 1800 digital pictures which were taken as I traveled the "ZMM Route".

I found your ZMM was factually accurate to a remarkable degree. In most cases, your descriptions in ZMM were sufficient to find, with reasonable certainty, an estimated 75% of these physical locations. Remarkable, especially, since 34 years have passed since your original trip. I think this is a credit to your resolve to "hold on to good old reality". Of course, this may be combined with the fact, that the greatest portion of ZMM Route is in areas of the country (rural and/or mountainous) where the population has remained steady or obviously (and sadly) in decline.

I photographed many of the physical locations you described and in cases where uncertainty arose, I photographed the alternates I happened to discover. I also photographed typical landscape scenes, birds and wild flowers along the route. (More research could be done using city directories, more interviews, etc depending on the need.)

I was able to photograph scenes of Hyalite Canyon and the location the Climax Scene on the California Coast. The information you sent about these locations was very valuable, indeed necessary. I would never have found them with out your help. The Steven Lindqvist series of articles was similarly needed and valuable. So, again I thank you very much for your assistance.

Copies of all my ZMM Trip digital photos (jpg files) have been made on archival quality Compact Disks (CD's). These disks will, fairly easily, show very nice photos on the computers available these days, even in public libraries. Software such as "ACDsee" or the "Zoom Browser" that came with my Cannon S30 Digital Camera, will vastly speed up the process of "clicking to the next photograph" on your computer. (A free trial down load of the complete "ACDsee" system is available from: http://www.acdsystems.com/English/Products/Photostitcher/index.htm
or http://www.acdsystems.coml)

It would be my pleasure to send you one of these ZMM Trip digital photos Compact Disks (CD's) disks for you to look at my photographs. I hope that you would want to review it for the pleasure of renewing old memories. If you do not want to do this, I of course, will understand and respect your decision.

Please understand: The photos on this "archival" disk will be in the "as taken", unedited, uncaptioned state. On this disk is "everything". It's the whole sequence of photographs as I took them in serial order. All the mistakes, out-of-sequence dead ends of my actual path of search are there. However I have supplied, on the disk, a "Read Me" file. This file is a partial itinerary keyed to the photo serial numbers.

My plan is to selectively edit (and add captions) on these photos just as soon as I possibly can. However this will take quite a bit of time. For this reason I offer to send you an advanced copy of the photos as they presently exist. Also a more complete key to the photographs will be forthcoming ASAP.

If you do want to receive a copy of these photos, I hope in due course of time, you would be willing to help in the identification / correlation of photos with the restaurants, hotels, motel, etc mentioned in ZMM book. This effort would be to the extent allowed by your time available. The need for accurate identification / correlation of these photos is for 1) Factual historical archival documentation of the events of the ZMM book for literary researchers, 2) Display on an Internet
Web sites to help increase reader interest and understanding of your ,?ook, and 3) Other reason yet to be discovered. Naturally some scenes you will not remember at all. But your help will be invaluable because many things you will remember!

You may reply by email or the U. S. Postal Mail at the following addresses. I would welcome a phone call.

P.S. I haven't yet had a chance to go through all the other articles on the ZMMREV (Adobe Reader) CD you sent, but I hope to go through it soon.

Sincerely

Henry Gurr, Professor of Physics Emeritus
University of South Carolina Aiken
471 University Parkway
Aiken SC 29801

Phone Work 803641 3453 (14 rings will get a secretary)
Phone Home 803 649 0424 (Ans Mach comes on, we will pick up) FAX 8036413251
e-mail HenryG@Aiken.sc.edu
My University Web Page [Revised to my present WebSite.]: http://www.usca.edu/math/%7Emathdept/hsg/
My Zen & Art Motorcycle Web Page: http://venturearete.org/ResearchProjects/ProfessorGurr/gallery/

Mr. Pirsig's Reply Stating He Would Be Interested to See My Photos Taken Along the ZMM Route. Dated September 2, 2002.

Dear Prof. Gurr,

I'm happy to read that everything went well on your trip of the ZMM route, and you found things accurately described in ZMM. Immediately after returning from that trip in 1968 I made hundreds of 4" x 5" notes of what I had seen and thought, then catalogued them in the manner described in Lila. These kept me from getting too imaginative during the four years of writing that followed.

It would certainly be interesting to look at pictures you took and comment on them. Some of them may bring back memories of things I haven't thought about since the trip itself. I'll comment on them as best I can.

Best regards,

Sighed by hand Robert M Pirsig

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My Cover Letter to Mr. Pirsig Describing the CD of ZMM Route Research Photos Enclosed. Dated 11 September 2002.

Dear Mr. Pirsig,

Thank you for your letter of 2 September 2002. I trust this letter brings to you an undamaged CD1 and it will work in your computer. Let me know immediately if there are any problems.

This CD1 was made with Microsoft Windows, and will be accessible most successfully with Windows Software. I have had adequate success with this CD1 on my Power Macintosh with the display the text of the "Read Me" file. My Mac Computer has MSWord. However, my Mac Computer can not open the CD1 photos, despite the fact that these photos have come up just fine on two different Windows Computers. If you have problems, I can send these files in a different format more suitable to your computer.

When you "open" this CD1 on your computer and click on the single file, you will see a listing of ten different files. The names of these files contain an abbreviated description of the first and last photograph on this respective file, separated by a % sign. The last file in the listing will be the "READ ME" document, which can be opened by MS Word or other text editor. You might want to make a paper print of this document and use it step by step to help identify the photos. Be sure to remember that the Read Me document gives the photograph serial number for ONLY the FIRST photograph in the series of photos that follow for each respective town. I hope it will be evident which the photos show the countryside that follow after the town photographs. My letter of 29 August 2002 gives additional information as to what to expect on CD1.

(Not included on CD1 are the photographs I took while on my way home from California to South Carolina. This includes photos of scenery along the general path of the California Trail, the Oregon Trail, University of the South at Sewenee Tennessee, visiting friends in Georgia, and study of Southern Barbecue (BBQ) traditions. These are on CD2 and are available upon request. This note hereby updates a similar but garbled sentences in the "Read Me" text. I trust not too many other typos will be found! )

As I mentioned in my previous letter, you will need a "photograph browser" which will show each picture quickly with just a "mouse click". There are a lot photographs on this CD1 (~1800 pictures). As I stated in my letter of 29 August 2002, you will want software that will allow you to "skip-by" many photos quickly, so you can get to the photos that interest you. (For example, you might want to skip the 8 shots of the numerous panoramas in these files.)

I hope many of the scenes will be recognizable. As soon as possible I will send full descriptions of these photos most needful of identification / correlation with scenes mentioned in ZMM. Additionally I recognize the need to send to you (ASAP) an edited version of these photos wherein I have culled out the photos that low relevance to your book. However, other tasks for the moment, must take precedence.

RESTAURANTS
As you look over the photos you should recognize the restaurant in Red Lodge, MT. Look closely for my photo of the large wall mounted photograph of the mountain highway up to Beartooth Pass. This must certainly be the Red Lodge restaurant mentioned in ZMM. Similarly for the restaurant beside the gas station mentioned in Lapine, OR. The first restaurant photographed in Mitchel, CA seems to be the best choice. Most of the other restaurants are educated guesses. I based my choices mostly on clues as to the year they were built, such as aluminum framed glass doors and style of restaurant furniture. I will send more detailed information, such as town location, direction compared to north, what else is around this area of town, etc. As is true for all of us, the more information you have, the more these old memories will successfully come back. From these successes, more and more clear memories will slide into place! I hope you will enjoy dong this and the time to reminisce will fit into your other priorities.

HOTELS, MOTELS, CYCLE SHOP, AND LAUNDROMAT
The Read Me document gives fairly extensive information about the ZMM hotels and motels that I discovered. The Hurtzler Hotel in Laurel, MT most certainly is the correct one. There are many many points of "fit" between ZMM and "reality" as shown in the photos. There is likewise little doubt about the Hillcrest Motel in Gardiner, MT.

I gathered a large amount of information concerning the ZMM sites in Miles City, MT. Following the city directory for 1968; I was able to photograph the location of the 1968 Bill's Cycle Shop and probably the Laundromat. I investigated the location of Hotels that were open in 1968 with the help of a librarian from the Public Library and the help of a staff person from the Miles City Historical Preservation Group. I discuss the Olive Hotel below. Other older Miles City hotels, still in existence, merited only one photograph.

The best choice seemed to be the Olive Hotel, and consequently I photographed the Olive Hotel extensively. See photos of both inside and out. I photographed the "Antique Room", which is the only room (with it's own bathroom) that fit the descriptions in ZMM. ONLY ONE such room seems to have EVER existed and was created perhaps 10 to 20 years ago. I will document the dates later. I also photographed an example of one of the 1950's remodeled rooms, and the older parts of the hotel that have had no renovations or improvements for a very long time. The "lion clawed cast iron bathtub" described in ZMM may have once existed at the end of the hallway where the bath and toilet facilities were located in this older part of the Olive. I photographed the two toilet rooms. There was an adjacent additional room where this "lion clawed cast iron bathtub" may have been. This room has since been used for other purposes and the bathtub is not there. I vaguely recall that a sheet metal shower stall was in this room and other laundry equipment. The "Antique Room" and other parts of the Olive, such as wood staircases, are a great "fit' to the ZMM descriptions!! Moreover this "Antique Room" and the Victorian Lobby of the Olive Hotel are indeed wonderful experiences. THAT is what used to exist. THAT is history! AND we can still experience it! So I am truly hopeful your memories will fit the photos of this grand old historic facility. It needs all the help it can get, before the bulldozers of progress come after it! The same could be said for all the older structures and facilities in the many small town along the ZMM route. ( Whoops!! Am I being a researcher or a promoter?)

WELDING SHOP
I talked to many people in Grants Pass, OR about the location to the ZMM welding shop. Although there were many neat and orderly welders in the 1968 Grants Pass, many people suggested Mr. Fixen. (Most probably Mr. Roy S. Fixen.) This is his actual name and not word play on his profession! Mr. Fixen's son Gary, still runs the welding business, but at a new location. It would be nice, and I think it's actually possible, to identify the correct person. The 1968 City Directory gives Mr. Fixen's shop as being at 954 S. W. 6th Street, and says "Since 1936". This location on the East Side of 6th street is now taken over by a one-half city block sized bank building. This location is two blocks south of the center of the business district and one block north of the big bridge that is my photos. This major north-south street has been the "Main Street" for a long time, hence the big bridge and intense traffic! In my photos, the restaurant (with aluminum framed glass doors and glassblock exterior parts plus several interior restaurant photos) is about one block north of the center of the business district and is also on the East Side of 6th street. Does this strike any memory recall?

MUCH MORE INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE
The above information is just a small sample of the information that I collected. My notebook pages, approximately 1.25 inches thick, are crammed with cryptic notes for every step of my trip.

I enclosed a copy of a newspaper article for your interest. Mr. Halbert has probably quoted me accurately. I can see that I need to speak much more clearly.

I am glad to hear you are willing to help in the identification / correlation of photos with the restaurants, hotels, motel, etc mentioned in the ZMM book. I just thought of another reason for accurate identification / correlation of these photos. Good identification will aid in the Placement of Historical Markers, which in turn will give one more reason (one more piece of history) to urge forward the Historical Preservation of these old but still useful and interesting buildings. Interesting just because they ARE A REAL part of history and the ways of people back then. Essentially Living Museums…..the best kind!

Sincerely

Henry Gurr, Professor of Physics Emeritus
University of South Carolina Aiken
471 University Parkway
Aiken SC 29801

Mr. Pirsig's Reply Re His Viewing the CD of ZMM Route Research Photos I Had Sent Him. Dated September 21, 2002.

Dear Henry Gurr,

Your CD pictures came right up on my Macintosh under a QuickTime jpeg icon and in about 4 or 5 hours I managed to click through all of them. Even though I saw the pictures in a rather random order it really took me back there. Almost all of the individual scenes, if I ever saw them, are too far gone in memory to identify specifically but the fact that I didn't know the exact location of them made them more Dynamic. They gave a feeling of seeing the West for the first time. Here are the comments. I've restricted myself to identifying only those places I am quite sure o£

[Editor’s note: As you will seen later letters, these photo numbers are completely scrambled due to the photo CD being made on a Windows Computer, but Mr. Pirsig opened the CD on a Macintosh Computer, which truncates my long filenames and renumbers the them to the point of non recognition. To see the photo(s) Mr. Pirsig mentions below, paste my [added photo number in brackets] below into search box upper right of all albums page on http://venturearete.org/ResearchProjects/ProfessorGurr/gallery/ ]

102D83 1.JPG This looks like the hotel in Gardiner. [107-0733]
102E83 1.JPG I don't remember eating at this Owl diner, but maybe we did. I think we ate in Cooke city at a place on the North side of the road that seemed to be up on a hill. [105-0586c]
102E84 2.JPG This looks like the stack of the smelter at Anaconda that I visited several times while teaching in Bozeman. [109-0971c].
106704 I.JPG I am enclosing a few pictures taken by Sylvia of John and Chris and myself on the trip at this spot. [106-0613]
10A98D l.JPG This is definitely where we stayed. I think we were in the next to the top cabin. The house above may have been built since we were there. [107-0735]
IOE802 1.JPG This has to. be DeWeese's yurt. It was built after the book came out. I seem to remember I slept there one night. [108-0820]
1 OE902 I.JPG This would be the main staircase in Montana Hall. I still get a sense of panic looking at it, feeling that in a few minutes I will have to face the students and I don't know what I will say t I [108-0828r]
IOF805 l.JPG I think the vertical white posts have been added for reinforcement and perhaps the metal edge reinforcements on the stairs. Otherwise it looks the same. [108-0827r]
10FA08 l.JPG I seem to remember there were very large trees in front of Montana Hall from this angle. Perhaps Dutch Elm disease got them. [108-0846c]
105-05 2.JPG this looks like a room we stayed at in Miles City. I can't verify the Olive Hotel. I seem to remember the hotel we went to was on a sort of hill north of the main street in Miles city but we got there at night and Sylvia did the talking at the desk. We were full of pizza and beer and really tired. [105-0511 Antique Room, Olive Hotel, Miles City, MT.]
10A98E...l.JPG I'm quite sure this is the Ellendale cafe. [103-0339]
[what photo?]
102881 ,.l.]PG This looks roughly like the room at the U of Chicago which I'm pretty sure was in Cobb. But the window is too fancy and clean. The room I remember as being dirtier. and without a blackboard. I don't think the hospital was across the street from Cobb but Cobb wasn't mentioned in the book and putting the hospital there foreshadowed what was coming. [101-0108]
1 02882...1.]PG This was definitely not the room. [101-0101]
102883,.1.]PG This could have been it. This is more the right size of table. [101-0133]
1 0288D ...l.]PG This' could have been it but I don't remember any picture on the wall. [101-0100 not sure which of my photos had the picture on wall.]
103688,.1.]PG. This says "Medical Center" but it doesn't look like anywhere I remember. [101-0103. 101-0102, 101-0117]
1OEC02...1.]PG This looks like the entrance I used. [100-0085]
10690E,.1.]PG This could have been John's house. If so the brick building next door is new. It was and I imagine still is a pretty depressing neighborhood. John and Sylvia moved to the country in the late Seventies. [To see this home, chick here and scroll down to “Former Home of John and Sylvia Sutherland on: http://venturearete.org/ResearchProjects/ProfessorGurr/gallery/albums.php?set_albumListPage=2 ]
1 06AO 1 ,.1.]PG This is definitely not it. Their house was not on a corner. [Sutherland former home was on South Colfax. My corresponding photo for ~2649 North Colfax is not available on Web.]
106A02,.1.]PG This intersection of Hennepin and Franklin, really brings down memories. For three very formative years (aged 8 to 11) I marched in a column of ducks (be¬hind a teacher named Miss Drake) to eat lunch at the Belmont Hotel behind the bus. Each morning I got off the street car to go to school at 22nd and Colfax (since torn down) and each evening got back on to go home. The intersection hasn't changed at all since the Thirties, except that the street car tracks are gone and now there, is a divider between the lanes on Hennepin Ave. [102- 0252s]

Best regards,

Signed by hand

Robert M Pirsig

---

My Letter to Mr. Pirsig Following-Up On The Points He Raised Concerning the CD of ZMM Route Research Photos I Had Just Sent Him. A New CD Of ZMM Route Photos With New Viewing Instructions Was Enclosed. Dated 30 September 2002.

Dear Mr. Pirsig,

Thank you for your letter of 21 September 2002. I am delighted that you were able to successfully view the photos on the CD I had enclosed. I can tell from your comments that you must have enjoyed those pictures. ("…the feeling of seeing the West for the first time.") Here I want to mention that the South Colfax neighborhoods actually appeared to be, healthy functional places for people to live. This applies to most of Minneapolis also. I have seen some examples of quite the opposite in lots of other major US cities. North Colfax, as you stated, is one such place. As you view the revised CD's enclosed, you will see that I photographed the inside of U. Chicago's Cobb Hall first in real time. Nearly all classroom are the same and you will see that the several rectangular tables are set in an open square in nearly all classrooms as photographed. See the "ReadMe" for more particulars. The U. Chicago's Social Studies (some one block SE of Cobb center to center) is the second building I photographed inside. This is apparently one of the few places at U. Chicago that has round/oval shaped tables of various sizes.

Right away I want to say "THANK YOU!" for reviewing them and commenting as to which photo numbers had places you could identify, such as hotels etc. It's indeed great to have your assistance!

But from the photo numbers you gave in your letter were completely different from the photo numbers that show in my CD. This fact, combined with the fact that you did not mention any of the facts on my ReadMe file (on that CD I sent on 11 Sept 02), tells me that I should have prepared your CD, compatible for a Macintosh.

Based on your evident problems, I placed a duplicate of the CD I had sent you in a Macintosh G3. Oh-man-oh-man!!! What a scramble in the file names for each of the 8 Photo folders. Even worse and total scramble of the photo numbers. I tried my duplicate of this same CD on a Macintosh G4. Insult added to injury, .… the real-time sequence on the photos was impossibly scrambled in addition!! It was so scrambled that it was almost impossible to find the "side by side" 8 (or 9) shots of my 360 degree panorama photos. (And I know to look for to find them!!) But despite these problems, the Macintosh computers I used were at least consistent to yours, so I was able to use each photograph number you gave in your letter of 11 Sept 02, to search for and successfully find, nearly all of the photos you commented on therein. So we are making progress, for this I am thankful.

Please find enclosed two revised CD: 1) One CD was saved in "Joliet" on my Roxio Easy CD burner soft ware. (Joliet is supposed to be for Windows Computers, but seems to work fine on both Mac G3 and a Mac G4.) When you bring up this CD, the photo numbers should now exactly correspond to the photo numbers on the paper copy of the ReadMe file enclosed. The file folder names for the eight major groupings of photos have been abbreviated to the standard two-letter code for the states of the USA. These eight photo files correspond to those listed as 01CF, 02CF, etc in the ReadMe Xerox copy. The ReadMe file is also on the enclosed CD. It is Saved-as "rtf" = " Rich Text File", which should come right up on your computer. But I have enclosed the ReadMe Xerox copy just in case.

The second CD enclosed is similar to the above except it is burned in "ISO 9660". This kind of CD is (I am told by someone who is experienced in these matters) supposed to be for all Computers. But this CD causes my friends Macintosh G4 to lock up. So proceed with caution and also it is wise to do Anti-Virus Virex scans. The file folder names are missing the numbers and the ReadMe is not there. I am still on the "learning curve". There is one folder name that says MN_MN , but it should be MN_MT.

Any way I trust this follow-up letter brings to you undamaged CD's and at least the first CD mentioned above will work much, much, better in your computer. Let me know immediately if there are any problems. If you have more problems, I will be glad to send refinements more suitable to your computer.

Be sure to remember that the Read Me Xerox paper document gives the photograph serial number for ONLY the FIRST photograph in the series of photos that follow for each respective town. I hope it will be evident which the photos show the countryside that follow after the town photographs. My letters of 29 August 2002 and 11 Sept 02 gives additional information as to what to expect in my photos. Be sure to consult them during any future viewing of my photos.

I have been focusing my time in getting these improved CD's into your hands ASAP. Consequently, I have not had the opportunity to completely "decode" the photo numbers you indicate on your letter. What you saw were Arbitrary Assigned "Macintosh Hexadecimal" Numbers". Macintosh does this when it does NOT have the space to use the photo numbers it found on those Windows Files of my first CD. Sorry for the confusion. After full study, I can send a more extensive reply.

PS. You stated that you were enclosing some photographs taken by yourself, John, and Sylvia. Alas no photographs came out of your letter. Naturally I would like to see them.

PSS: Your photos, and those of the Sutherlands', that still exist from your ZMM trip, would be quite valuable in reconstructing the exact locations of the historical sight and scenes of your book. And of course, how this would be handled would be entirely up to you.

More later and thanks again.

Sincerely

Henry Gurr
Professor of Physics Emeritus
University of South Carolina Aiken
471 University Parkway
Aiken SC 29801

Mr. Pirsig's Reply To the "Better CD of ZMM Route” Photos I Had Sent Him. Dated October 5, 2002.

Dear Henry Gurr,

Thank you for the remake of the CD's of your trip. I had no idea the file numbers would change between PCs and Mac and the files would be scrambled or I would have run it on my Compaq computer. The only reason I didn't was that the Compaq is much slower than the Mac and there were a lot of files.
One of the problems of saving everything is that later there is so much of it you can't find what you are looking for. I've set up elaborate file systems to remember where things are but over the years those slides of our trip have been mislaid. I wrote you they were coming before I started to look for them, and then when I couldn't find them, forgot to delete the sentence that they were coming. At age 74 these omissions seem to occur with increasing frequency.
However, the lost slides were reproductions made in 1975 for a lecture about the 1968 trip and I still have the original stereopticon slides from which they were made. I have made a note to find a commercial reproduction service that can digitize from 35 mm slides. So if I don't lose the note and if there is a reproduction service that can digitize stereopticon slides without mining them, and they don't lose the slides, and I don't forget that I said I would send the digitized reproductions to you, that's what I will do.

Best regards,

Signed by hand

Robert M Pirsig

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Mr. Pirsig's Reply To My Earlier Request Re Photos & Info About The CD of His Original 1968 ZMM Route Photos He Was Enclosing. Dated October 28, 2002.

Dear Prof Gurr,

Here are the pictures I promised you. I took the originals to the camera store on Oct. 7, twenty-one days ago, and just got them back today. We sort of live in the boondocks here and when we asked why it took so long the salesman said his dog got sick. For a moment A worried that the dog threw up on the slides, but they said no it was a dog they had had for many years and when it had seizures they were so worried they just didn't want to face the world for a while.
I asked for maximum resolution and they took the request very seriously. Some of the slides are 23 megabytes, and will take time to open, but you can always reduce the resolution for the web.
A noticed some Brazilian idiots have defaced your website. I would guess your Internet Service Provider can tell you how to stop this, since the larger websites never seem to have this problem.
Anyway, here are the pictures. The titles on the CD were put on by the camera store. The accompanying sheets will explain what describes what, and the thumbnails should guard against any numbering mix-up.

Best regards,

Signed by hand

Robert M Pirsig

Mr. Pirsig's Information Re His Original 1968 ZMM Route Digital Photos (On a CD) He Enclosed. This Information, and the Photos To Which It Applies, May Be Viewed At:

http://venturearete.org/ResearchProjects/ProfessorGurr/gallery/

[Start enclosure explaining digital photos on CD sent.]

A CB360_~1.TIF
1. Chris, Bob 1st day N—This is the picture that everyone sees in black and white. It was first sent to the English publisher, Bodley Head. They put it on their jacket and everyone picked it up from there. The location is a rest stop in North Dakota on the way to Oakes at about 5 or 6 PM during the first day out. The storm described in Chap. 3 was fictional.

B. PACKED-1.TIF
Sylvia, Chris, John 1st day N.D. —Same location as A

C HAYSTACK.TIF
Haystack at rest stop N.D. 1st day—Same location as A

LUNCHB-1 .TIF Morning Campground, S.D. —This scene is from the begin¬ning of Ch 6 at the campground in South Dakota. The accompanying text is:
"Later I turn and see John is up and looking at me uncomprehendingly. He is still not really awake, and now walks aimlessly in circles to clear his head. Soon Sylvia is up too and her left eye is all puffed up. I ask her what happened. She says it is from mosquito bites. I begin to collect gear to repack the cycle. John does the same. " When this is done we get a fire started while Sylvia opens up packages of bacon and eggs and bread for breakfast."

THEGUY-1.TIF
John, Chris, Bob at pass—You probably will immediately recognize this place on the road from Red Lodge to Cooke City It's in one of your slides.

BIKESI-1.TIF Chris, John, Sylvia at Pass—Same location as E.

TROUTD-1 .TIF
1. Gennie DeWeese and neighbors boy.—This is how Gennie looked in the summer of '68. The scene is described in Chap. 14 where Gennie says, "Some neighbors just came over with a mess of trout for dinner. I'm so pleased." I try to think of something appropriate to say, but just nod." Gennie told me later she would never have said a thing like that, but it was too late to change it.
HORSE&-1 .TIF Josh, Bob Deweese, Chris—This is the DeWeese's youngest son, Josh, on the horse with DeWeese and Chris standing by.

BOYRID-1 .TIF Chris, Horseback—Same as H

TENTIN-1.TIF Chris in Cottonwood Canyon—This is described in Chap. 19 as follows:

He's a slow waker and it'll be five minutes before his mind warms up to the point where he can speak. Now he squints into the light."

HONDA&~2.TIF
Idaho Forest Road This is the scene at the beginning of Ch 24:
"I get out of the sleeping bag. It's cold and I get dressed quickly. Chris is asleep. I walk around him, climb over a fallen tree trunk and walk up the logging road. To warm myself I speed up to a jog and move up the road briskly.

HONDA&~1.TIF
Morning in Oregon—This is from Chap. 28. In the background you can make out a white helmet and beside it a sleeping bag that has Chris in it. The accompanying in text reads:
"Cold out! Feels like winter! Where are we, that it should get this cold? We must be at a high altitude. I look out of the sleeping bag and this time see frost on the motorcycle. On the chrome of the gas tank it's sparkling in the early sunlight. On the black frame where the sunlight hits it it's partly turned to beads of water that will soon run down to the wheel. It's too cold t o lie around. I remember the dust under the pine needles and put my boots on carefully to avoid stirring it up."

[End enclosure explaining digital photos on CD sent.]

---

My Letter to Mr. Pirsig Thanking Him For Sending the CD of His Wonderful "Original 1968 ZMM Route Photos," Plus a Long List of New Questions Which Mr. Pirsig's photos Raised. Dated 12 November, 2002.

Dear Mr. Pirsig

Thank you for your letter of 28 Oct 02. Your CD was received in good condition, with exception of a one inch long split in the Crystal case. Evidence of localized external pressure in transit. This CD came up great on one of the universities Mac Computers that had Quick Time. It also worked in the Windows machine that had a Windows Quick Time plug in (as I remember).

Your pictures had wonderful color! It was really great to view them! As you stated, I will have no problem reducing these to approximately 100 k bytes, so these can be appropriately placed on my web page. I am thrilled to have the honor of dong this!

To do the "byte reduction", I will have to ask a person here who has PhotoShop on his Macintosh computer to help me. I will be sure that the photos you sent me will not otherwise be forward to other people without your OK.

You will be glad to hear that the "Hack Job" on my web page has been removed. They got in through a "back-door" that someone was not careful to close! Also we are well on the way to solving a two month old "password impasse" to putting photographs on these pages. I am nearly ready to start "installing" the "jpg's.

In your photo of your campground in South Dakota, I recognized immediately the lake and opposite hills at the Shadehill Reservoir at the South Dakota Lwellen Johns Recreation Area. I will (soon) have a close look and see how your photo vantage point contrasts with mine. I believe the two points will be not very far apart!

Your Beartooth Pass parking lot photo was instantly recognizable! It was good to see the photo of Gennie and Bob DeWeese. The trout are on historical record! Also fun to see what their property looked like back then. The background vegetation in both of your camping photos fit what I saw in those areas.

You saw FROST on your Honda at your Campground in Oregon! I ALSO saw FROST on my picnic table where I was camping! I was at the "Corral Springs National Forest Campground" 2 miles West of OR Rt. 97 about 50 miles South of La Pine. La Pine is where in ZMM you report getting Breakfast (p 303.5). My frost photos are soon after photo 07CF 113-1354, but prior to photo 07CF 114-1408. Look for close-ups of a picnic table. You will see the frost melting in the patches of Oregon morning sunshine duplicating your experience. I also experienced spongy dust while camping there. I had to push my tent way under the pines where there was thin mat of pine needles, to get away from it!

It is great to see, in color, the black and white version of you and Chris on your loaded Honda. Such a neat and information packed photo! As you are aware, it is several different places on the web. I showed my Xerox of that photo to Gennie DeWeese and Daughters Tina & Gretchen. I also showed them a glossy of the publicity shot of you kneeling, wrench-in-hand-arm-on-knee at the back on your 64 Honda 305cc. They were thrilled to see these! Genie was also highly interested in a note-card reproduction of the "Church of the Minorites". She said she had never before seen the painting or reproduction. She continued and said that her [artist] husband [Robert] would have deduced you were an outstanding person just because you had singled out that reproduction for your office wall! Enclosed email copy has more on my visit there.

QUESTION: Where is the Picnic Table Canopy (PTC)? You say the "way over-loaded Honda" photo was taken at a Roadside Rest Area in North Dakota. I can assure you that I was on the look-out for that very Picnic Table Canopy (PTC) my entire ZMM trip. I am troubled by the fact that I did NOT see, anywhere along the ZMM Route, or any roadside rest areas that had any thing like the PTC that is shown in that photo. Moreover I do not find any road rest areas marked on my 1989 Rand-McNally anywhere in Southern 1/2 of North Dakota. My map DOES show many road rest areas along secondary roads in Idaho and Minnesota. Therefore I conclude Rand-McNally in 1998 must not have known of any rest areas anywhere along the ZMM Route the central Dakotas. Puzzle! Puzzle!

There are quite a number of places along SD Rt. 13 & SD Rt. 11 where the highway has been "modernize". They have straightened out sharp curves and made bypasses around the towns. The highway that I followed may have been changed since you came through, or I didn't take the correct highway. (The route I followed is specified in the ReadMe Document (RMD) I sent my previous letter.) There is very little "land pressure" in the Dakotas, so and it is unlikely that the PTC was removed or the roadside rest area eliminated. It would continue to be used in place. Your "loaded Honda" photo is "kind of famous" and deserves some attention to continued search for the location where it was taken. Thus I am constrained to ask; do you have any notes or photograph sequence that could be used to help narrow down more accurately where the PTC is, or was? Your notes taken at the time or other photographs (prior and after) may provide clues.

Although I failed to find any thing like the PTC on the ZMM Route, I DID SEE and photo graph a PTC just like your photo in Idaho along I-15 at a rest area 15 miles South of Pocatello Idaho (South Eastern Idaho). At that point I got to thinking that your PTC, was in some part of Idaho? But your photo shows the Great Planes and no mountains and thus not Idaho.

QUESTION #2: Where is the ZMM roadside rest area South of Grangeville ID? Were there other ZMM resting points in the Salmon River Canyon?
Along Rt. 97 from Grangeville ID to New Meadows ID, I found extensive ~1990 construction of a new two lane expressway. See Idaho Highway Rt. 97 on your map. By design and many $, this road down what is called "Whitebird Hill" South of Grangeville, is now much less steep and much straighter than you experienced it (and described in ZMM). Please see my "ReadMe Document" (RMD) page 10, and read text at photo 06CF 110-1129. This describes my research findings. As I state therein, I was un-able to find one (? Or two?) of the three old roadside rest areas shown on my old 1998 Rand-McNally. One of the three rest areas (with a Cast Iron Pump?) may have been somewhat North of Whitebird ID. This must have been the pavement toward and into that town you followed. It is evidently the old road to Whitebird, prior to the expressway construction. The old pavement for at least 3 miles North of that town must still there. It is somewhat visible from my photograph panorama vantage point on the Southern edge of Whitebird. Also seen in the foreground at that vantage point is the strip of pavement that comes South from that town. See the series of photos that are the panorama sequence taken at that spot. However, I did not have the time to "back-track" from the Bottom of the Whitebird hill, back through Whitebird to investigate. There are now many riverfront pullouts for "scenic view + historical explanation signs" along Rt. 97 in the Salmon River Canyon. See my photographs for the "scenes" at many of these pullouts. However, I hypothesize that the ZMM rest area in the "narrow canyon near the river" (that may have had the Cast Iron Pump in 1968), is now the second of the three rest areas marked on my Rand-McNally. This is now, a modernized roadside rest area plus a very popular riverfront recreation area. This green and grassy well irrigated tree surrounded park, is squeezed (sandwiched) between the highway and the huge roaring Salmon River deep in a very narrow canyon with the closest and most vertical walls yet along the Salmon River Canyon. The general surroundings are just as ZMM describes. See my photographs some what before the first Riggings LD photo=06CF 110-1129. Except for the possibility that the water-well site may now be covered with a medium sized (?water supply service?) building, there was no evidence of a cast iron pump, or any left over cement to show where it may have been! I can say this because I searched the entire park for just this evidence! Can you say anything to support or reject my conjecture that this was your 1968 roadside rest area ZMM p263.5?

(Side Note: My search for the 1968 iron pump at the now-a-days very nice rest area, on the ZMM Route, some 50 miles East of Miles City, likewise was unsuccessful. I did find one cast iron hand water pump along MN Rt. 55, West of Minneapolis MN. But I missed at least two of the rest areas along that route, so there may be more iron pumps still there.)

(Second Side Note: The above mentioned ID Rt. 97 is marked as Rt. 95 on my 1962 Idaho map. This map shows Rt. 95 from way North of Radium Springs in Canada to practically Blythe CA, at the Colorado River near the Mexican border!)

QUESTION #3: Where is the schoolyard? Further South I could not find the schoolyard mentioned in ZMM. See my ReadMe entry for photo 06CF 110-1149. Any guesses where that was?

QUESTION #4: What was the ZMM trail (roads) from Prinville to Bend OR? In 1968 you may have avoided the big town of Redmond OR by going "zig-zag" over back country roads to the East of Redmond OR. There are a number of those "slower high quality roads" But in following those roads you may have missed the "Lava Butte National Park. This Park has a really big and perfect cinder cone volcano with a road up to the top. See photos that follow photo 07CF 113-1338. In my ReadMe I miss-labeled this as Lavalands Volcanic N. P. This park does not appear on my 1989 Rand-McNally, and thus may have been established soon there after. This the volcano area may not have been as inviting to tourist back then. Also local people led me to believe the arrow straight pavement I traveled on was itself a more recent throughway that paralleled the older roads, shown on my map to the west, that you had to follow. Do you remember this park or volcano? Can you say anything to support or reject the conjecture that may have followed in 1968 a "back-country short-cut" connecting Prinville to Bend?

QUESTION #5: Where is the "housing development with the ridiculous tiny lots? (ZMM p243.6)
While traveling South towards La Pine OR, I traveled slower than average and closely studied the landscape on both sides of Rt. 97, for any present-day evidence of this place. For many miles prior to La Pine, practically ALL of the land adjoining the highway is under the close control of the National Forest Service. No houses or businesses AT ALL! The only place that would seem to qualify as the site where you camped in 1968, was on the NW corner of an intersection on Oregon Rt. 97, some 5 miles North of La Pine OR. This intersection as I remember it is the only road, dirt or paved, for quite a distance prior to La Pine OR. This is the only road that for many-a-mile goes West toward North Twin Lake. This intersection is possibly "T" junction. I can not remember clearly what is on the East side of Rt. 97 in that immediate area. If any road (or drive) goes East at that intersection, it is a minor road. In addition to other nearby private properties near that intersection, there is a fairly large housing tract, filled with medium sized house trailers. Judging from the general quality of the vegetation plus age of the mobile homes, this could well have been started in 1968, and had a very slow rate of people moving into those sites. As is normal for most other trailer villages, it was crowded side-by-side, cheek to Jo! So it is safe to say that it has ridiculous tiny lots! I did not take a photograph at the time because I thought better candidates would be "On Down The Highway"! I was wrong, but by the time I realized this, it was too late to go back. Anyway, as I remember, the land visible from the highway, all around that intersection was fairly flat and except for the private property, was covered with pine forest dense enough to block vision to a depth of say 30 feet into the forest. This flatness to my memory seemed to extend for at least a mile in all directions. The surrounding mountains were not high enough at that intersection to be seen above the trees around that area. Can you say anything to support or reject the conjecture that this may have been the location of your 1968 "spongy dust camp" just North of La Pine OR? Incidentally, I did experience, and photograph deep spongy dust that fit the ZMM description at the Lava Butte National Park some 50 miles North of La Pine on Rt. 97. See photos that follow photo 07CF 113-1338.

QUESTION #6: Where is the ZMM restaurant in La Pine OR? While we are on the topic of La Pine, please look at the "Restaurant + Filling Station" photos following photo 07CF 113-1354. I'm pretty sure this MUST BE the ZMM restaurant in La Pine OR. As shown in the photos, these two places are immediately side by side. Nothing else in La Pine comes anywhere near to fitting the ZMM descriptions. Also the construction style of both of these buildings matches 1968 style. Please study my numerous photos of the area, and see if any of it fits your memory. I hope you will enjoy looking at the unique cloud formation. Do you see the "crown"? Can you say anything to support or reject my conjecture that this was your 1968 La Pine restaurant?

QUESTION #7: Would you be willing to check some of your other photographs? What about the photographs or notes of John and Sylvia? Are they still living souls on this sweet earth?
Do any of your other photos show scenes, or background features that could be used to identify various of the ZMM stopping points, in towns, campgrounds, parks etc? Your trip photos need not be showing any thing that is actually mentioned in ZMM. I think any thing that actually happened on that trip should well be combined into the historical record.

The backgrounds of certain of your photos could be used to crosscheck against some of scenes that appear in my photos. It might be possible to identify (tease out) the streets you were on and so correlate to what I was able to find. In most cases I could only narrow down the ZMM restaurants to two or three possibilities in any one town. (As I have stated in the "ReadMe Document") Most of the important Restaurants, Hotels, Motels, Mountain Peaks, Rivers, Skylines, trees, plants, etc that appear in my photos, have at best, uncertain correlation with ZMM passages. There have been many, many, very remarkable correlations of my findings with what is stated in ZMM. This leads me to conclude that many, many, OTHER good correlation's are yet to be found! I'll be glad to do most of the grunt-work to work on said correlations.

Here's an example: I believe I would be very valuable to identify the correct Hotel in Miles City. You may have photos that show buildings in the background that are identifiable and thus deduce where you-all must have been "touring". And from this narrow down the actual hotel. There has not been all that much change in the central areas of Miles City since 1968, so building identification should still be possible. Also there is a local historical preservation organization. They have many, many, historical photographs. These people were very willing to help me in my search, and I am convinced they will continue to do so. I am enclosing some Xerox copies that may help. Your favorite map-making web site (or software) may have a better map of the areas beyond my Xerox.

That’s plenty enough for now. I must rush this to the post box.

Again: Thanks for all your help.

Sincerely

Henry Gurr

Mr. Pirsig's Reply To My Long List of New Questions Which Were Raised By Mr. Pirsig's Original 1968 ZMM Route Photos. Dated November 20, 2002.

Dear Prof Gurr,

Here are some comments and answers to your letter of Nov. 12, 2002.

A think Lionel Feininger made more than one picture called "Church of the Minorites." I noticed a picture on another web site that had that title but was not the same as the one that was in my office. The correct one can be accessed at file:///Ti%2OHD/ Desktop%20Folder/feiningerl. jpg.

Question 1: I vaguely remember we were indecisive when we first got into North Dakota on the ZMM trip and did a lot of zigging and zagging down country roads. I looked on Microsoft's Terraserver http: //terraserver. homeadvisor. msn. com/ image.aspx?t=1&s=12&x=756&y=6420&z=14&w=1 for a couple of hours but found nothing. My wife said you might try sending the picture to the highway department that governs the region between Minnesota and Oakes and see if anyone recognizes it.

Question 2: It sounds as though you have found the right place. It was a narrow strip of grass between the road and the river and was quite busy. I'm glad they got a new freeway in. The old road was crowded and dangerous.

Question 3: A can't even remember writing about a schoolyard.

Question 4: I remember that the run from Prineville to Bend was at the end of a very long day and we were really tired and things started to get bad between Chris and myself after that. I think we took the main road with hardly any stops.

Question 5: I remember that there were pieces of twine that demarcated the lots. They would have disappeared soon after I was gone. But your description sounds like it.

Question 6: If the book says we ate in La Pine, that's what we did, but I have no memory of it today.

Question 7: There are no other photographs except one that duplicates the scene at Bear Tooth pass and was omitted by the processor. Those are all the pictures I took. As I said at a lecture later, if I had known what that trip was going to turn into, I would have taken thousands! But at the time my mind wasn't on towns or scenery, but on the problems with Chris and the motorcycle and the details of the trip. I didn't expect my larger life to be anything more than a continuation of a failure it had always been.

I haven't heard from John or Sylvia for several years now. They were divorced many years ago and have gone separate ways.

I vaguely remember we came into Miles City on Route 12 and turned right at around N. 7th St, plus or minus a few blocks, and maybe went up a hill for a block or so and then found a hotel on the southwest side of that side street—or maybe it was a Pizza place and the hotel was somewhere else. Sylvia found it and we didn't have much money and she was pleased with the price. So pick the cheapest hotel in that area in the year 1968 and the probability you have found it will be increased. lt wouldn't be the St. Paul Hotel. I would have remembered that name. On the basis of prices alone I would guess the Stone hotel. You might try writing to John Sutherland. My last address for him is:

Sutherland, John C.
3704 35th Ave. S.
Minneapolis, MN 55406
(612) 722 6893

Best regards,

Signed by hand

Robert M Pirsig

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My Letter to Mr. Pirsig Thanking Him For His Detailed Replies to My Questions Concerning Mr. Pirsig's Original 1968 ZMM Route Photos Sent Earlier. Also Raised Topic of ZMM Copyright Permission and Reported My Conversations With Mr. John Sutherland of the ZMM Book. Dated 16 April 2003.

Dear Mr. Pirsig

I trust this letter finds you well and moving ahead with your Meta-Physics of Quality.

Things here are going well for me, although work is not going as fast as I would like. (As I write the previous sentence, I realize I am still too much afflicted with those "Poisonous 20th century attitudes".)

This letter is for the important matter of copyright attention. Progress on other areas will be in an appendix.

[Here I asked Mr. Pirsig for copyright permission to include ZMM passages on my ZMMquality WebSite. This portion of my letter was very long and not very illuminating, so I decided not to reproduce it here. (Copy sent on request.)]

Your 12 Photos are now, finally, installed on my WebPage Gallery. I am thrilled to have the honor of dong this!

The CD you sent with your pictures worked perfectly! It was really great to view them and get them installed on http://www.ZMMquality.org/Gallery [No longer valid] I had no problem reducing these to approximately 100 k bytes each. I asked John Westbrook Jr. who has PhotoShop on his Macintosh computer here in Aiken, to do the "byte reduction". While he was working on the photos he noticed the need for dust speck removal and color correction. These tasks he completed with skill and enthusiasm.

I am sorry for the delay in getting your photos installed. I wanted to get my part I Photos installed about the same time as your photo were installed AND I just could not spark Mr. Westbrook to any faster action. But overall, I think we'all got better results because I waited. Any way, you probably have already seen them. I do hope you approve of the results!!

My ZMM Part I photos on http://www.ZMMquality.org/Gallery [Link no longer valid] have many places where more "fine tuning" is obviously needed. I will get to this ASAP, but first I must get this letter in the mail and complete a number of other long time neglected tasks out of the way.

I have been in contact with your friend John Sutherland. Again thank you for his address. He wrote me a long letter and in it said he would send you a copy also. Did he do this? If not I can forward a copy. He seems to be living at the same address you gave me, and his current phone # is 612-722-6893. He has been away to his favorite places in New Mexico, for the past several weeks. I spoke to him on the phone two days ago. He had just gotten back home.

He said he wanted this spring/summer to himself travel the "ZMM Route", revisit the old places, and take photographs. This would be a great opportunity for me to gain more information and "high validity" information about the historical "sights and scenes" of the ZMM book. I DO HOPE I can receive an invitation to be present as he travels. However at my last phone call, he seemed uncertain about that idea

There are other matters I wish to bring to your attention, but the mailman is here soon and I must stop.

Henry Gurr,
Professor of Physics Emeritus
University of South Carolina Aiken
471 University Parkway
Aiken SC 29801

Mr. Pirsig's Reply To My ZMM Copyright Query and Positive Comments Re Google Finding My Website, As Well As Newly Missing Webpage Re His Father, Maynard Pirsig, Former Dean Of The Minnesota Law School. Dated April 24, 2003.

Dear Prof Gurr,
I'm glad the pictures have worked out for you. At the time of writing this I am unable to bring them up -on my computer but get a "Not Found" message instead. A did see some of them at the end of March so I'm sure this is temporary condition.
I also noticed also that the link to my father has been taken down by the University of Minnesota Law School. However it has been preserved at the following URL: http:// www.rnoq.orgninks/LinkData/DeanPirsigTriliute.html so you can switch the link over to it.
When I sent you the photographs it was with the intention that they be in the public domain, which means anyone can use them and no one can copyright them. If someone challenges your use of them you can quote this letter as proof of permission.
The copyright for the text of ZMM is controlled by HarperCollins Publishers. Under my contract with them it is their exclusive legal right to grant the permission for reprint. The general rule is that if you use 500 words or less you can do so without permission. More than that and they will charge you a fee, which on request can be waived. However it should be noted that the last time I looked I found ten websites that have printed the entire text of ZMM without permission. My editor at Bantam has told me publishers are unable to stop it.
John Sutherland did send me a copy of his letter to you. It brought back a lot of memories. He is very easy to get along with and if you want to go over the ZMM route together I'm sure he can provide an interesting perspective on the book.
That's too bad that people are not noticing your website yet but there are so many millions of websites I think it takes a while for them to get known and linked to. I also noticed that there is no way for a casual surfer to immediately know from your home page that your site includes the ZMM trip pictures. If this is made noticeably apparent to them I would guess that will increase the hits. Then, as your site advances over the years the way www.moq.org has, I think you will find that the Search Engines will move you up in their lists to produce more and more viewers who will raise you even further up the lists in a self-stoking cycle.

Best regards,

Signed in hand Robert M Pirsig

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On 17 June 2003, I Asked Mr. Pirsig If He Would Grant Video Rights For a ZMM Documentary To Be Made. Here Is His Reply. This portion of my letter was very long and not very illuminating, so I decided not to reproduce it here. (Copy sent on request.)

Mr. Pirsig's Reply To My Query Concerning ZMM Documentary Video Rights. Dated June 20, 2003.

Dear Prof. Gurr,

Your ideas sound very good. However one matter that stands in the way is shown by the following correspondence with another filmmaker.

***** Start correspondence between Film Producer Richard Chapman & R. Pirsig *****
Dear Mr. Pirsig,

Here's the headline: I'm interested in bringing ZEN AND THE ART OF MOTORCYCLE MAINTENANCE to the screen in some form, be it a theatrical feature film, a documentary about you, your life, your work and philosophy, or in some other form you may have toyed with over the years. I've included a short bio and will be happy to elaborate on it should you wish to explore the possibilities.
I'm a veteran screenwriter and film producer who decided to dip my toe in the fountain of youth by teaching - I'm currently Senior Lecturer in Screenwriting at Washington University in St. Louis. I've still kept my day job, however, and recently co-wrote and produced the HBO Original film, LIVE FROM BAGHDAD, nominated for three Golden Globes, including Best TV or Mini-series. Why am I telling you this? You're probably not the type of individual impressed by awards and I'm sure you've been approached in the past by other more illustrious filmmakers. I understand Robert Redford was at one time involved but I have no idea what resulted from his interest. Did you grant him the film rights? If not, are you inclined to revisit the prospect of attempting to translate your work to film?
I first read the book while attending Georgetown University, where I learned the joys of riding a Triumph Bonneville out on the Virginia backroads, alongside, if you can believe it, Davey Crockett's great-great grandson, or so he claimed. Rufus Crockett rode a Harley and first introduced me to your work. Now, thirty-five years later, Pm even more excited about your world-view, since I've seen and experienced a pretty good chunk of what life has to offer. What's impressive to me is how relevant your thoughts are today and the possibilities of artistically creating a film experience that will resonate with your original readers as well as inspire a whole new generation.
What does that all mean? Let's talk about it, if you feel like it, or toss this letter out right now - no harm, no foul. A couple of things I'm doing have brought me to you. I recently helped found the Harvard Medical School Center for Mental Health and Media. I'm helping them produce films dealing with a wide range of mental health issues and I'm proud to say we're coming at it from a pretty weird angle. . .not what you'd expect from that august institution. Another road leading to you is named Thorn Lane, the street I live on at my Wisconsin home. I left LA a few years ago and took my family back to my childhood home in Milwaukee. My neighbor down the lane introduced me to Jeff Bluestein, CEO of Harley-Davidson and we hit it off. It seems that motorcycles keep reappearing in my life at every turn these days. I passed your book on the shelf the other day and it occurred to me, I'd take a shot and drop you a line. In trying to locate you, I discovered you're pretty much a neigh¬bor of a good friend of mine in Maine, Angus King. I grew up with his wife, Mary. When I heard they'd just hit the open road with their family in a giant motorhome on a journey around the US, I once again thought of you and your book.
Anyway, I could keep on going but I think I'd rather speak to you on the phone, or visit you if you'd entertain the idea of discussing ZEN in film terms. I'm pretty much a Luddite, but I do have email - don't know if you're a fan of communicating in that fashion. I also don't want to waste any more of your time if you're flat-out not interested, so don't worry about not getting back to me. At her agent's urging, I once wrote Annie Dillard a long impas¬sioned letter about filming PILGRIM AT TINKER'S CREEK and never heard a word, so I got the message. Some authors prefer to be left alone and I certainly am sensitive to that. So, I'll conclude by simply telling you I'm a huge fan of your VOICE, and if you'd care to engage in some dialogue, I'd be honored. My #'s in St. Louis:

If you've gotten this far, I wish you All the Best.

************************************************

From: Pirsig <xxxx@xxxx.com>
To: Richard Chapman <xxxxx@xxxxxx.com>
Subject: Reply
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003
Thank you for your letter concerning film rights to Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance. It has always been a very personal book and I have told Robert Redford and others that the film rights to it will not be released during my life.
Documentaries about the intellectual subject matter of ZMM and its sequel, LILA, are another matter. If you haven't already done so, you
might read LILA, and some internet discussions of it on www.moq.org, and take a look at a new book by Dan Glover called LILA'S CHILD that has just become available at http://www.lstBooks.com/bookview/12646. I can't imagine anything more difficult than trying to make a film out of the Metaphysics of Quality, but maybe you can think of something.
Robert M. Pirsig

************************************************

From: Richard Chapman <xxxxx@xxxxxx.com>
To: Pirsig <xxxx@xxxx.com>
Date: Friday, January 31,2003
Subject: Re: Reply
Dear Mr. Pirsig,
Thank you for getting back to me so quickly. I am glad you have wisely chosen not to grant film rights for a fictional treatment of ZMM . That endeavor would ultimately prove unsatisfying and not worthy of the book. I would, however, be very interested in taking on the challenge of a documentary exploring the Metaphysics of Quality. I agree it will be extremely difficult, yet I do have some embryonic thoughts. First, I will certainly read all the works you have suggested and after digesting that material, I'll see if I can develop an approach that's worth pursuing.
Best regards,
Richard Chapman

************************************************

From: Richard Chapman xxxxx@xxxxxx.com
To: Pirsig <xxxx@xxxx.com>
Date: Wednesday, April 16,2003 Subject: Possibilities
Dear Mr. Pirsig,

I am finally reestablishing contact with you about the possibility of presenting the intellectual subject matter of ZMM, LILA and MOQ in some form accessible to an audience. After following your advice and reading your collected works and the thoughts and ruminations of others, I have come up with a possible vehicle which may come closest to representing your ideas in the purest form.
Originally I was on the trail of a documentary film but that would entail lengthy interviews with you and I felt that might be an unwelcome invasion of your privacy. The more of your words I consumed, the more I became convinced that your philosophy and world view transcended the personality and character of the author. With that in mind I focused on various venues to present the words and imagery in their purest form, leaving the more personal aspects of your work out of the equation. I've arrived at a departure point for discussion and if it intrigues you, we can go from there. If not, I've certainly enjoyed grappling with all this.
I believe there's the potential for a live, mixed-media theatrical presentation which would include selected readings, visual multi-screen projection of supporting imagery, and other elements (holography? digital sound components?) to best communicate the Metaphysics of Quality. Perhaps something of this nature has been suggested before but there's a lot of technology now available to innovatively bring forth your ideas with imagination and impact. There's one catch, however and you're probably ahead of me on this one. WHO's doing the reading? One individual...an actor...an ensemble? It's not drama...not a lecture...all I can think of to define it is "an intellectual experience."
Just a quick example — and this is off the top of the deck: can you have a monologue on classicism vs. romanticism taken directly from your writings, while on a screen the audience sees detailed, schematic engineering diagrams, or pages from a parts catalogue, juxtaposed with film or still footage of the glorious landscape seen from the POV of a motorcycle on the open road...or a boat on the lake or river? What about music? Surely, that opens up a realm of possibilities. What I'm suggesting is a blend of science and the humanities presented artistically, but always supporting the philosophy.
If this kernel of an approach strikes any chords I'd be delighted to
further explore and elaborate. I also have some ideas of how and where this experience can be mounted.
Thanks for listening,
Richard Chapman

My most recent letter (4/18/03) to Richard Chapman was as follows:

What you say sounds excellent to me but whether it can be made to seem excellent to an audience that is not very excited about intellectual ideas is a real question. However, I think if you keep coming back to the theme of "What is quality?" with the kind of growing circular structure of a symphonic fugue it may work.
One such circular loop might be, for example, that a culture can be defined as a consensus of values; that is, of quality. Because each culture judges itself by its own values, each culture sees itself as superior to others, and sees itself as morally justified in subordinating other cultures to its own cultural rule.
The Taliban would be one good example, with some library film footage available. Japanese history might be another, with even more footage. The Russian communists have even more. We have few problems with the Canadians because their Anglo-Saxon values are so close to ours. There has always been tension with the Mexicans because their dominantly Indian values are so different. The values of the University, the "Church of Reason" might be regarded as a rather narrow and recent set of values, and come in for some critical examination.
This could lead to the question of whether values are relative or absolute. Most Victorians seemed to think they were absolute. Most Twentieth Century academics have seemed to think they are relative. The Metaphysics of Quality says they are absolute, based on evolution, and this takes you into the heart of the Metaphysics of Quality itself. Now, with the audience wondering which way is right, you can get into deeper and deeper levels of abstraction of the MOQ. The example you have chosen of classic and romantic is a good start but can be superseded by the deeper division and organization in Chapters 9 and 12 of Lila.
But this is just off the top of my head and is not intended to be any kind of instruction as to what to do. I'm certainly pleased that you've taken an interest in the intellectual aspects of ZMM and Lila as the basis for a film. Out of maybe 50 solicitations for a film about my work, you're the first one to show this intellectual interest.
****** End correspondence between Film Producer Richard Chapman & R. Pirsig ****

Since April 18th when this was sent I've heard nothing from him. He may have dropped the project or, more likely, he may be working on a script. Since he has the same interests you have he may want to join with you on your project or compete with you, or just get mad that someone else seems to be encroaching on his efforts. There is no contractual comittment here, but whatever his attitude is, A think it would be wise to see where he is at and what he wants to do.
I have had dozens of interviews In Hollywood and elsewhere about films of ZMM. The first thing I learned is that everyone is a filmmaker. The first thing A have learned to ask them is what films have they done. Although you have a better understanding of the ideas and issues in ZMM and Lila, the following resume from the internet shows he has a much deeper film experience and this is vital.

Senior Lecturer Richard Chapman is a veteran screenwriter and producer in film and television. He has created, produced and written over two hundred hours of network series, including such credits as SIMON & SIMON (CBS), THE NEW ALFRED HITCHCOCK PRESENTS (NBC), Disney's ABSENTMINDED PROFESSOR, and the Golden Globe nomintated HBO Original Movie, LIVE FROM BAGHDAD, starring Michael Keaton and Helena Bonham Carter. (Listen to a radio discussion with Richard Chapman about his work and "Live from Baghdad" Link to Radio Discussion ). His career in motion pictures fea¬tures such films as MY FELLOW AMERICANS, starring Jack Lemmon and James Garner and THANK YOU FOR SMOKING, an upcoming project for Mel Gibson's ICON Produc¬tions. Chapman has written over twenty motion picture screenplays for such stars as Meg Ryan, Alec Baldwin, and Bette Midler. Currently, he is producing a feature length docu¬mentary, SHOOTING THE MESSENGERS, the behind the scenes story of how journalists from all media – print, tv, and photojournalism – reported the war in Vietnam. It is a con¬troversial film culled from fifty hours of new interviews with such icons as Walter Cronkite, David Halberstam, and Frances Fitzgerald. The film is scheduled from release in the fall of 2003.

The best of all possible worlds would be one in which your understanding of the philosophical issues in Lila could be combined with Chapman's expertise and connections in filmmaking. It's clear that you both have much knowledge that the other needs

Best regards,

Signed in hand Robert M Pirsig

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The HSG ZMM Video Documentary Effort, Alas, Soon Ground To A Halt For Lack Of Resources.

So the project was terminated. Mr. Chapman has recently told me he is still interested In Resuming This Work, But My Emails to Him During Summer 2007 have not been answered.

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At Christmas 2004, I sent Mr. Pirsig a Holiday Greeting and as PS asked if he had any suggestions or changes he wanted in my website. Here is his reply. Dated January 7, 2005.

Dear Prof Gurr,

Thank you for your Christmas newsletter. I certainly have no complaints about your website, and see that the internet search engines now place it high on the list of ZMM sites where it belongs. I'm also extremely grateful for the letter you sent to Anthony McWatt suggesting that his problem may be with the breadth of vision of his examiners rather than with his thesis. It may just turn the tide. The external examiner, who apparently will decide, seems to be a decent person who does not quite catch on to the idea of value as ultimate reality. I imagine he is not very happy with his position, knowing he will not please his peers if he passes McWatt, and will not please his conscience if he fails him.

Best regards,

Signed by hand

Robert M Pirsig

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Click here for letters to and from Mr. Pirsig's years 2006 thru 2007.

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